Comments on: Edelman: Must try harder http://strange.corante.com/2006/10/21/edelman-must-try-harder Picking out patterns in the chaos Wed, 16 May 2012 20:59:10 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.6.1 By: superfancy88 http://strange.corante.com/2006/10/21/edelman-must-try-harder#comment-2243 superfancy88 Thu, 14 Dec 2006 21:48:43 +0000 http://strange.corante.com/2006/10/21/edelman-must-try-harder#comment-2243 Call me a simpleton American but it would have been funnier if it was all transparent. WalMart sponsoring people to camp across the country in a camper=funny. And the response to the problem of getting busted would have been funnier if Wal Mart had just had fun with the whole situation, follow up ads that explained the whole thing. Cancer is not funny. Child labor is not funny. Astroturfing (so long as it's non-political) is naturally interesting and hilarious! In fact, "astroturfing" -- ha ha ha! (Are we supposed to grow loyal to WalMart -- hangars full of body coverings and near-broken toys -- because of their *ADS*? Amuse me, dammit, Bring me up! Call me a simpleton American but it would have been funnier if it was all transparent. WalMart sponsoring people to camp across the country in a camper=funny.

And the response to the problem of getting busted would have been funnier if Wal Mart had just had fun with the whole situation, follow up ads that explained the whole thing.

Cancer is not funny. Child labor is not funny.

Astroturfing (so long as it’s non-political) is naturally interesting and hilarious! In fact, “astroturfing” — ha ha ha!

(Are we supposed to grow loyal to WalMart — hangars full of body coverings and near-broken toys — because of their *ADS*? Amuse me, dammit, Bring me up!

]]> By: Cornelius Puschmann http://strange.corante.com/2006/10/21/edelman-must-try-harder#comment-2242 Cornelius Puschmann Mon, 23 Oct 2006 15:52:12 +0000 http://strange.corante.com/2006/10/21/edelman-must-try-harder#comment-2242 What I fail to understand is why having some kind of influence over the bloggers was considered being of importance by Edelman (and most people would argue that sponsorship is a way of influencing). Repeat after me: "the message" is dead, gone and not coming back. Blogs are conversations, conversations are social interaction and social interaction is about your relationship to a person, not a statement. Nothing the two floggers could have written would have been more damaging than the revelations about their relations to Edelman. Note that it's not even the relationship itself which is problematic, but the lack of transparency. What this is really about is an error of judgement: choosing control of the message over the credibility of those who deliver it. The medium is not the message. The medium is the messenger. What I fail to understand is why having some kind of influence over the bloggers was considered being of importance by Edelman (and most people would argue that sponsorship is a way of influencing).

Repeat after me: “the message” is dead, gone and not coming back. Blogs are conversations, conversations are social interaction and social interaction is about your relationship to a person, not a statement.

Nothing the two floggers could have written would have been more damaging than the revelations about their relations to Edelman. Note that it’s not even the relationship itself which is problematic, but the lack of transparency.

What this is really about is an error of judgement: choosing control of the message over the credibility of those who deliver it.

The medium is not the message.
The medium is the messenger.

]]> By: Stephen Davies http://strange.corante.com/2006/10/21/edelman-must-try-harder#comment-2241 Stephen Davies Mon, 23 Oct 2006 09:57:56 +0000 http://strange.corante.com/2006/10/21/edelman-must-try-harder#comment-2241 Just to be clear. I invited the bloggers to the Edelman/Technorati event. I know some of them personally; met them more than once in the real world. My intentions for inviting them were not for "show". Just to be clear. I invited the bloggers to the Edelman/Technorati event. I know some of them personally; met them more than once in the real world.

My intentions for inviting them were not for “show”.

]]> By: maggie fox http://strange.corante.com/2006/10/21/edelman-must-try-harder#comment-2240 maggie fox Sun, 22 Oct 2006 23:44:31 +0000 http://strange.corante.com/2006/10/21/edelman-must-try-harder#comment-2240 Suw - great post, really glad I found your blog! As far as the whole Edelman Flog Fiasco goes, aside from the cultural issues you discuss, I think it's an important cautionary tale for anyone planning to blog their business. Honesty & transparency are the only way to go, for two reasons: no one will "buy" what you're "selling" if you're not genuinely engaging, and reporters and news producers everywhere have realized that unmasking a fake blog/blogger is a cheap and easy way to break a big story. Lesson: flog at your peril! Suw - great post, really glad I found your blog! As far as the whole Edelman Flog Fiasco goes, aside from the cultural issues you discuss, I think it’s an important cautionary tale for anyone planning to blog their business. Honesty & transparency are the only way to go, for two reasons: no one will “buy” what you’re “selling” if you’re not genuinely engaging, and reporters and news producers everywhere have realized that unmasking a fake blog/blogger is a cheap and easy way to break a big story.

Lesson: flog at your peril!

]]> By: Steve http://strange.corante.com/2006/10/21/edelman-must-try-harder#comment-2239 Steve Sat, 21 Oct 2006 22:09:26 +0000 http://strange.corante.com/2006/10/21/edelman-must-try-harder#comment-2239 Richard, I am not a PR expert, but publicity stunts can backfire. Although they can garner positive attention, stunts can also send less than positive signals. For instance, in this case, many feel that Wal-Mart threatens the vitality of the middle class as it stifles its competitors and forces its employees to accept less than enviable wages with meager benefit packages -- if any benefits are offered at all. The fact that Wal-Mart was caught fostering a blog that asserts that the company benefits the middle class fuels its opponent' concerns with more fodder. If Wal-Mart knows that it truly benefits the middle class, then why did it try so hard to dispel rumors stating otherwise? Does that give credence to the stances of its opponents? Regardless, in this age of wide accessibility to cheap global communication that enables the masses to opine, things can get out of hand quickly as is the case now. A vast army of amateur pundits blogging in their underwear -- or possibly wearing anything else, including nothing -- from home can quickly counter famous pundits via the word of mouth on their blogs. Since they are so dispersed and unorganized, it is hard to combat such a movement. While publicity stunts are sexy at times, they can also reveal that the responsible party behind them is ugly as a stick. That yellow smiley face that revels in lowering prices now has a black eye. Richard,

I am not a PR expert, but publicity stunts can backfire. Although they can garner positive attention, stunts can also send less than positive signals.

For instance, in this case, many feel that Wal-Mart threatens the vitality of the middle class as it stifles its competitors and forces its employees to accept less than enviable wages with meager benefit packages — if any benefits are offered at all. The fact that Wal-Mart was caught fostering a blog that asserts that the company benefits the middle class fuels its opponent’ concerns with more fodder.

If Wal-Mart knows that it truly benefits the middle class, then why did it try so hard to dispel rumors stating otherwise? Does that give credence to the stances of its opponents?

Regardless, in this age of wide accessibility to cheap global communication that enables the masses to opine, things can get out of hand quickly as is the case now. A vast army of amateur pundits blogging in their underwear — or possibly wearing anything else, including nothing — from home can quickly counter famous pundits via the word of mouth on their blogs. Since they are so dispersed and unorganized, it is hard to combat such a movement.

While publicity stunts are sexy at times, they can also reveal that the responsible party behind them is ugly as a stick. That yellow smiley face that revels in lowering prices now has a black eye.

]]> By: Marina making pictures http://strange.corante.com/2006/10/21/edelman-must-try-harder#comment-2238 Marina making pictures Sat, 21 Oct 2006 17:15:14 +0000 http://strange.corante.com/2006/10/21/edelman-must-try-harder#comment-2238 What a scandal I think Edelman is doing very bad by producing lies in a form of a blog. Readers have the right to know when they are exposed to propoganda. Thank you for sharing this story with me ! What a scandal I think Edelman is doing very bad by producing lies in a form of a blog. Readers have the right to know when they are exposed to propoganda.

Thank you for sharing this story with me !

]]> By: anu http://strange.corante.com/2006/10/21/edelman-must-try-harder#comment-2237 anu Sat, 21 Oct 2006 16:54:12 +0000 http://strange.corante.com/2006/10/21/edelman-must-try-harder#comment-2237 From Richard Edelman's comment: "Where I disagree with your post is that this Wal-Mart program was astro-turfing. It was a publicity stunt aimed at the mainstream media with a new media component." wow. Suw, I think your last paragraph is pretty well spot on, and I'm just left with the feeling that Edelman are co-opting the values associated with the blogosphere, so that they can launch 'publicity stunts aimed at the mainstream media with a new media component'. This is more than just a disclosure issue, this goes right to the heart of what blogging and social media is about...ie conversation versus publicity stunts. wow again. From Richard Edelman’s comment:
“Where I disagree with your post is that this Wal-Mart program was astro-turfing. It was a publicity stunt aimed at the mainstream media with a new media component.”

wow.

Suw, I think your last paragraph is pretty well spot on, and I’m just left with the feeling that Edelman are co-opting the values associated with the blogosphere, so that they can launch ‘publicity stunts aimed at the mainstream media with a new media component’.

This is more than just a disclosure issue, this goes right to the heart of what blogging and social media is about…ie conversation versus publicity stunts.

wow again.

]]> By: richard http://strange.corante.com/2006/10/21/edelman-must-try-harder#comment-2236 richard Sat, 21 Oct 2006 13:30:49 +0000 http://strange.corante.com/2006/10/21/edelman-must-try-harder#comment-2236 "Richard has outlined the steps Edelman are taking to" Watch your grammar. “Richard has outlined the steps Edelman are taking to”

Watch your grammar.

]]> By: Richard Edelman http://strange.corante.com/2006/10/21/edelman-must-try-harder#comment-2235 Richard Edelman Sat, 21 Oct 2006 12:38:49 +0000 http://strange.corante.com/2006/10/21/edelman-must-try-harder#comment-2235 Suw, I understand your disappointment with the firm. I am not trying to avoid responsibility for the problem; I am taking this as a serious matter which requires immediate attention. I do believe that PR can participate in a substantive and positive manner in the blogosphere. I agree that it means we have to change PR to be transparent, genuine, two-way (so we listen, not just talk). Where I disagree with your post is that this Wal-Mart program was astro-turfing. It was a publicity stunt aimed at the mainstream media with a new media component. We failed to be open about the identity of the photographer--our mistake whether in new or old media. We were entirely clear that the entire tour was funded by Working Families for Wal-Mart, with the travel writer receiving a fee for her time and the photographer simply his gas and food expenses. I appreciate your sentiments that this is a long term education process for our people. I am prepared to make that investment. President Abraham Lincoln, when asked about a significant reverse suffered during the Civil War, said, "It hurts too much to laugh but I am too old to cry." Suw, we are in this for the long run. Mistakes have been made but we are going to get up and ski the hill again and again until we get it right. Suw, I understand your disappointment with the firm. I am not trying to avoid responsibility for the problem; I am taking this as a serious matter which requires immediate attention. I do believe that PR can participate in a substantive and positive manner in the blogosphere. I agree that it means we have to change PR to be transparent, genuine, two-way (so we listen, not just talk). Where I disagree with your post is that this Wal-Mart program was astro-turfing. It was a publicity stunt aimed at the mainstream media with a new media component. We failed to be open about the identity of the photographer–our mistake whether in new or old media. We were entirely clear that the entire tour was funded by Working Families for Wal-Mart, with the travel writer receiving a fee for her time and the photographer simply his gas and food expenses.
I appreciate your sentiments that this is a long term education process for our people. I am prepared to make that investment. President Abraham Lincoln, when asked about a significant reverse suffered during the Civil War, said, “It hurts too much to laugh but I am too old to cry.” Suw, we are in this for the long run. Mistakes have been made but we are going to get up and ski the hill again and again until we get it right.

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